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Good CD-Rs?

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Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Oct 31, 2017 1:27 pm

Hi all,

Been going back over the old posts on the subjects of reliable CD-R disks and am no wiser as to which would be a good brand because all the People Who Know About These Things stocked up on Taiyo Yuden before they stopped manufacturing. This not being an option open to me, can anyone suggest what would be a good brand to use?

Note: folkies are, as you would expect (and so they should be) a little behind the techno-curve on things like this and CDs are still highly regarded. Hence I still need to produce them from time to time.

CC
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby James Perrett » Tue Oct 31, 2017 3:41 pm

About the only suggestion that I can make is to take a look at HHB who usually source good quality discs for their own brand media.

http://www.hhb.co.uk/hhb_express.php?section=15
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby Mike Stranks » Tue Oct 31, 2017 5:03 pm

As I think I've said before I use http://www.cvbmedia.co.uk/ on the recommendation of John Willet. As you know, not a man to cut corners or go for the second-rate.

I must have bought approaching 1000 from them over the years and have only had one failure from their bargain-basement range which I keep for rough 'n' ready copying.

Service is always good; it might be worth calling them and seeking advice... they were always strong advocates of TYs in the past...
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Oct 31, 2017 8:42 pm

Thanks both. For the second time in the last few days the phrase "Reassuringly expensive" probably applies.

Cheers,

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Oct 31, 2017 8:49 pm

I see CVB Media say this on their

JVC/Taiyo Yuden stopped production of all CD and DVD products at the end of 2015.
CMC purchased the technology from JVC/Taiyo Yuden and has committed to maintain the quality and consistency of the JVC/Taiyo Yuden products.

With the help of Taiyo Yuden engineers, CMC built specialized, dedicated production lines using the exact same processes, raw materials and strict quality control measures to ensure the Taiyo Yuden quality is maintained.

The CMC made products will be branded as “CMC Pro” and all cartons will be labeled “Powered by TY Technology”.

Does this carry any credence here?

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby James Perrett » Tue Oct 31, 2017 11:32 pm

Reports that I've seen elsewhere say that the CMC manufactured Taiyo Yuden discs are not as good as the Japanese T-Y's with error rates something like 3 times higher. CMC have done the same thing in the past with TDK and in my personal experience the CMC TDK's were nothing like as good as the Japanese TDK discs.

Yes, they'll all play fine for a while but it is what happens after a few months/years that really sets the different manufacturers apart.
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Wed Nov 01, 2017 12:25 am

Thanks for that, James. I'll have a good think about the options offered by HHB and CVB. Interestingly the "Taiyo Yuden" disks on CVB are much the most expensive there, meaning you can still trade on a name even when it no longer exists ...

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Mon Jan 08, 2018 7:15 pm

James Perrett wrote:About the only suggestion that I can make is to take a look at HHB who usually source good quality discs for their own brand media.

http://www.hhb.co.uk/hhb_express.php?section=15

Just taken delivery of 100 of these. Expensive at 50p per disk but if they live up to even a fraction of their 200 year archival quality claim they'll see out my time. Thanks again for the recommendation.

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ken long » Mon Jan 08, 2018 8:48 pm

ConcertinaChap wrote:
Note: folkies are, as you would expect (and so they should be) a little behind the techno-curve on things like this and CDs are still highly regarded. Hence I still need to produce them from time to time.

What does this mean? Are you using them to release product commercially or using them to archive. If the former, it could be much cheaper to send a DDP to a plant and run off 500-1000. If using them for the archiving then that would be a mistake.
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ken long » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:24 am

While CDs themselves may last a while (200-300 years we dont know ), I’m seeing much fewer drives being manufactured.
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Jan 09, 2018 11:55 am

I'm using them for very short runs (e.g. 20 or so) of audio CDs. OK?

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PS many years ago I worked in a paint laboratory and learned about some of the techniques they used to estimate the life of paints. They will have conceptually similar techniques for CDRs and so I'm willing to believe these CDR are likely to last a decent time.
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Jan 09, 2018 12:12 pm

Yes, for very short runs -- essentially printing-on-demand -- purposes like yours, I don't see a problem with using CD-Rs at all.

But I agree with Ken that if you're expecting to sell a hundred discs or more (over a timescale of a few years) it would almost certainly be more cost-effective to have proper red-book discs pressed commercially -- even if you end up throwing 400 of them into the recycling.

And relying upon CD-R for long term archiving is not a good idea either -- not because of the projected life of the disc itself, but because of the potential difficulty in finding a working disc replay machine in 25 years time...

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:44 pm

For the avoidance of confusion I agree with all of this and I do use duplicators (or advise to use duplicators) once it looks like someone is heading towards 50. But the capability to do very short runs is very useful, especially, as I say, in the folk world. And using archival quality CDRs for anything serious means I can be reassuring if someone's been reading worrying stuff about CDR lifespan.

FWIW I think CDs will be readable for rather more than 25 years because of the backward compatibility that has, so far at any rate, been built into all later format machines like DVD and Blu Ray. That will stop one day, of course, probably when they abandon the disc form factor altogether but with so many CD capable devices around it'll be a while before they're all gone. And then there'll be some bright spark who thinks that CD was a wonderful format and due for a revival and they'll start appearing once again at a premium price to boot. That marvellous 16 bit laser warmth, they'll say. These modern quantum holo-crystals just can't equal it ;)

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Jan 09, 2018 1:56 pm

ConcertinaChap wrote:FWIW I think CDs will be readable for rather more than 25 years because of the backward compatibility that has, so far at any rate, been built into all later format machines like DVD and Blu Ray. That will stop one day, of course, probably when they abandon the disc form factor altogether but with so many CD capable devices around it'll be a while before they're all gone.

I admire your confidence, but I don't entirely share it!

Yes, CDs will have an extended usability period because of the compatibility with DVD and BluRay, as you rightly point out. However, the days of physical media for video are rapidly declining, and there is already very little demand from the young generation. They are heavily conditioned -- and content -- to access their music from online streaming services, and increasingly the same is happening with video too as highspeed broadband connections are an expected utility. Netflix, Amazon Video, Virgin etc are mainstream content providers, and most people I know spend much more time sourcing films and TV programmes online than they do from Bluray or DVD.

So I give the CD 25 years max... :-)

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby Frank Eleveld » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:24 pm

BluRay basically still exists because of the gaming industry. As has been pointed out by Hugh, the DVD/BluRay market for (HD/UHD) video is rapidly declining, even though the rate is slower than originally anticipated just a few years ago.

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:33 pm

Hugh Robjohns wrote:So I give the CD 25 years max... :-)

By which time I'll be 81. Somebody else's problem ;)

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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Jan 09, 2018 2:43 pm

:lol: :thumbup: :clap:
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ManFromGlass » Tue Jan 09, 2018 3:38 pm

ConcertinaChap wrote:
Hugh Robjohns wrote:So I give the CD 25 years max... :-)

By which time I'll be 81. Somebody else's problem ;)

CC

For clarity. The CDs will be somebody else's problem or you will be?
Badum Tish! :headbang: :headbang:
If it was about me I'd say the latter for sure!
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ken long » Tue Jan 09, 2018 4:05 pm

ConcertinaChap wrote:
By which time I'll be 81. Somebody else's problem ;)


This is very similar to the way some people treat the environment.
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Re: Good CD-Rs?

Postby ConcertinaChap » Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:15 pm

ManFromGlass wrote:For clarity. The CDs will be somebody else's problem or you will be?

Both, probably.

ken long wrote:This is very similar to the way some people treat the environment.

Well, what can I say? To get from my lighthearted joke about CD lifetimes to a short sermon about environmental responsibility in one jump is quite impressive. Well done!

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