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Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

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Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby garrettendi » Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:53 am

As an experiment and a means of learning how to sing, record, mix and master, I'm going to record a cover of a song. If it makes any difference - it's a Christian worship song (I do a whole bunch of different genres in my solo project).

Now obviously I can't post this on SoundCloud as is, nor onto here for the much-needed feedback without rights and permissions from the original artist.

So how do I go about getting permission? Would I be expected to pay even if it's released for free without making any profit on it? Who would I contact? The songwriter? The record company?

This may be too big an exercise for me to undertake!
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby forumuser939850 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:00 pm

Yeah, legally probably you're not allowed to post a recording of a cover, so I would just give (email?) it to people who agree to listen to it.

It's relatively easy to license a cover song for publication (mechanical license), but it's my understanding that it's not a good idea to put it for free then anywhere because it could create costs for you every time it's streamed.

Some services offer to get you a mechanical license for you for a c. $10 fee. Random links on the topic:

http://www.makeitinmusic.com/licence-cover-song/
http://diymusician.cdbaby.com/music-rig ... ver-songs/

Some people say you could just post it and see what happens, but I would not recommend that.
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby CS70 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:30 pm

Normally a published song is licensed from the publisher or a company which have acquired the rights - Getty music for example. But that has a cost so makes little sense to do it just for learning? Why publishing the results? If your aim is to get feeedback, make a Dropbox link and share it in a private place (for example the music lounge here) and take it down after the feedback round
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby garrettendi » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:11 pm

CS70 wrote:Normally a published song is licensed from the publisher or a company which have acquired the rights - Getty music for example. But that has a cost so makes little sense to do it just for learning? Why publishing the results? If your aim is to get feeedback, make a Dropbox link and share it in a private place (for example the music lounge here) and take it down after the feedback round

That's true I guess. But wouldn't that breach the rules for Dropbox for the same reason as SoundCloud? The terms and conditions on Dropbox state that you cannot share copyrighted material you do not own.

Also is that not against the rules of the SOS forum? I know someone got banned for a week recently for sharing a SoundCloud with unlicensed copyrighted material.
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby Dave B » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:12 pm

So with all the tracks that I have put up on Soundcloud, the only takedown notice I ever got was my Floyd band playing 'Breathe' as we used a sample of 'speak to me' to start the track. But my Soundcloud account is full of covers - usually live recordings or rehearsal recordings.

As with most things, the law is there to protect against exploitation - so if this is your version of a song, then the worst that usually happens is that someone gets snotty. They'd have to be pretty cold hearted (and terribly un-Christian) to give you serious grief. Just make sure that you don't profit from the song - so no commercial release or charging - and most people are cool.

:)
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby Guest271017 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:23 pm

Dave B wrote:So with all the tracks that I have put up on Soundcloud, the only takedown notice I ever got was my Floyd band playing 'Breathe' as we used a sample of 'speak to me' to start the track. But my Soundcloud account is full of covers - usually live recordings or rehearsal recordings.

As with most things, the law is there to protect against exploitation - so if this is your version of a song, then the worst that usually happens is that someone gets snotty. They'd have to be pretty cold hearted (and terribly un-Christian) to give you serious grief. Just make sure that you don't profit from the song - so no commercial release or charging - and most people are cool.

:)

You bring religion into it, yet you condone thievery. Doesn't appear you're very 'Christian" if you pick and choose Commandments you'll follow, does it?

If you gain an education from the exercise, you've technically profited.

Anyone who finds the need to post covers just shows a lack of talent and creativity. I can play any Zeppelin tune you can name, to the album, but I've never done a cover let alone posted one.

There's a lot of skirting of copyright rules around here lately and not much being done about it. Threads here and in the lounge clearly link to copyrighted yet are allowed to remain. Why would anyone link to their music on a site frequented by the type?
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby garrettendi » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:25 pm

mashedmitten wrote:You bring religion into it, yet you condone thievery. Doesn't appear you're very 'Christian" if you pick and choose Commandments you'll follow, does it?

If you gain an education from the exercise, you've technically profited.

Anyone who finds the need to post covers just shows a lack of talent and creativity. I can play any Zeppelin tune you can name, to the album, but I've never done a cover let alone posted one.

There's a lot of skirting of copyright rules around here lately and not much being done about it. Threads here and in the lounge clearly link to copyrighted yet are allowed to remain. Why would anyone link to their music on a site frequented by the type?

I am not intending to steal anything, hence why I asked how I can get permission?
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby Guest271017 » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:26 pm

garrettendi wrote:
mashedmitten wrote:You bring religion into it, yet you condone thievery. Doesn't appear you're very 'Christian" if you pick and choose Commandments you'll follow, does it?

If you gain an education from the exercise, you've technically profited.

Anyone who finds the need to post covers just shows a lack of talent and creativity. I can play any Zeppelin tune you can name, to the album, but I've never done a cover let alone posted one.

There's a lot of skirting of copyright rules around here lately and not much being done about it. Threads here and in the lounge clearly link to copyrighted yet are allowed to remain. Why would anyone link to their music on a site frequented by the type?

I am not intending to steal anything, hence why I asked how I can get permission?

Sorry, got wound up. Wasn't speaking to you, you're doing the right thing by getting permission.
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby garrettendi » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:30 pm

mashedmitten wrote:Sorry, got wound up. Wasn't speaking to you, you're doing the right thing by getting permission.

No worries. And I see your point about a lack of creativity with regards to covers, but I just feel I really need to stetch myself by recording something that can be compared to an original.

If for instance, my vocals are completely out of tune on an original recording, you could argue that that's "supposed to be like that" but when you have a direct comparison to an established piece of music, you can really get constructive feedback.

At least, that's how I feel.
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby Mike Stranks » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:30 pm

I think you'll be fine...

Just make sure you disable downloads... :)

IME most published Christian artists are keen for others to develop their skills and are relaxed as long as you're not stealing their bread or profiting from their original work.

The big problem over the years has been Christian bands/artists not being given their dues "because it's for church (or related activity) use." I know several people whose songs are the staple of contemporary worship who have been exploited in this way. Funny how some Christians think that civil law doesn't apply to them if their law-breaking is for "Christian" purposes. :roll:

... and :thumbup: :clap: to you for being aware of the issue and asking the question. :)
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby Dave B » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:35 pm

FYI : I'm not very Christian. There are a lot of different opinions within the artistic community on this issue. If copyright is so cut and dry, why do they do restricted use licensing for small scale - but still technically commercial - runs?

If you take your argument to it's logical conclusion, then we should be charging kids in the streets for singing. Or people with car windows open and music on for 'public performance'.

People 'profit' from discussing with others on these very forums - should we demand payment when we post a response on a thread?

So let's knock on the door and ask for Ronny Real here.

Soundcloud has the facility to make songs uploaded 'private' so that they are not publicly streamable. So you could upload to there and only publish a private link.
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby garrettendi » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:38 pm

Dave B wrote:People 'profit' from discussing with others on these very forums - should we demand payment when we post a response on a thread?

If you guys ever do this I don't think my bank balance would ever recover!

So I'll take this opportunity to express gratitude to everyone on this forum!
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby zenguitar » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:46 pm

garrettendi wrote:Also is that not against the rules of the SOS forum? I know someone got banned for a week recently for sharing a SoundCloud with unlicensed copyrighted material.

There are legitimate ways to use copyright material, Hugh and I both made that clear. The member wasn't banned for that, he was banned for explicitly saying he had no respect for rights owners, and expressing it in very offensive language.

Andy :beamup:
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby garrettendi » Thu Oct 05, 2017 2:48 pm

Thanks for explaining Andy. No offence or accusation was intended, sorry.
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Re: Acquiring permission to post a cover on SoundCloud

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Thu Oct 05, 2017 3:17 pm

mashedmitten wrote:Are you really trying to compare copyright infringement to a forum, or is it that you don't have solid ground to stand on and are grasping at straws?

This is getting quite tiresome. It is not your role to admonish the views and opinions of others.

If you feel someone is abusing the copyright rules then by all means flag it up using the report system for the mods to consider and resolve, but flaming in public isn't going to help anyone.

As far as I can see here, everyone is being respectful of copyright law and the reasons for its existence, while seeking and offering practical and sensible ways of solving the OPs dilemma of gaining experience and feedback.

But since you're so keen on the forum rules, can I remind you of this part:

Unfortunately, like every other online forum, the SOS Forum sometimes attracts the attention of Internet Trolls who seek to cause disharmony among the legitimate users by making spurious or inflammatory posts. Anyone suspected of this kind of behaviour will be warned by the moderating team only once (check your forum Private Messages!). Continued inappropriate posts after a warning has been issued and not replied to will result in the immediate deletion of their user account.

Your recent posts have caused disharmony (I can't remember the last time I had so many reports from so many different people in the same thread!) and are certainly inflammatory. Consider this the warning...

H
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