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Reaper 6 is out

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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby Sam Spoons » Mon Dec 09, 2019 3:45 pm

Reaper doesn't interrupt, the nag screen displays at start up only. It is also fully functioning in every respect, and it used to be that if you continued over the 60 day evaluation it would continue to work with nowt more than a nag screen message along the lines of "you are on day 495 of your 60 day evaluation period" :D Not sure if that is still the case though.
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby The Red Bladder » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:07 pm

All sorts of wild speculation about why Reaper is both faster and has a smaller footprint and the reality is that there are many reasons, not the least of which is the use of anticipative processing. i.e. the CPU is processing commands before the programme has reached that point.

It is smaller for a variety of reasons but underlying these various reasons is company politics or rather the lack of them. Reaper's code is managed by one person - Justin Frankel - and it is my guess, that person is really good at what he does!

The other SW packages are managed by project managers and from time to time, these are changed as they move up in the world or get fired.

The effect this has is simple - with Reaper, some improvement is made and as a result, there is a bug. Let's say that the audio slips sideways by a few seconds if you do X. The Reaper developers will roll back to the last time this happened and realise where that is coming from. The person who managed the SW code in 2008 is the same person today. That provides a completely different level of understanding of what is going on. If the cause is, say, 15 lines of code, those 15 lines can be altered, rewritten or deleted.

If you are the (overworked and underpaid) Polish coder for ProTools, you have absolutely no idea where to look. The person who wrote that code in India was fired in 2011, the Ukranian person who revised that code, was fired in 2013. You could spend the next two weeks digging for the reason the audio slips sideways, or you could just write a few lines of code to put it back where it belongs. As you are paid by results (and you would like to keep your job!) and the whole operation will only add half a millisecond to the processing time, nobody will even notice the extra few lines of code. Now, every time the user does X, the programme has to go through a simple IF-THEN routine and the audio is moved to the left and then moved back again.

If that happens here and there, it is no big deal, but the reality is that it becomes more and more lines and the poor old CPU is spending more and more time, processing redundant commands and shunting data around needlessly. Nowadays, programmers (or rather subcontracted programming companies that put in the lowest bid) are paid by results. Throwing extra lines at a problem or a new feature brings results!

Programmers do not get paid extra for elegant programming!

Justin Frankel takes the long view - he knows that a programme with fewer lines of code that work faster will pay dividends over the years to come. He even writes a blog on aspects of coding and how to reduce the number of commands - http://1014.org/?article=518

It's all there for you to mug-up on, if you are into C++ compilers!
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby The Bunk » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:47 pm

N i g e l wrote:
I think 30 days is long enough to get the gist of somthing but I dont like not being able to "save" and continue later from where I left off. Strabgely, I dont mind being interrupted every so often but I do hate waiting for uTube adverts to finish, in 5 4 3 2 1..
maybe thats it.
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Are you saying you can't "save" any new work you've done? Sorry if I've misunderstood that but I don't have that issue with my upgrade which I am still "evaluating", more through laziness...I will of course when I can get my *rse into gear.
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby N i g e l » Mon Dec 09, 2019 4:51 pm

Sam Spoons wrote:Reaper doesn't interrupt, the nag screen displays at start up only. It is also fully functioning in every respect, and it used to be that if you continued over the 60 day evaluation it would continue to work with nowt more than a nag screen message along the lines of "you are on day 495 of your 60 day evaluation period" :D Not sure if that is still the case though.

From peoples comments I believe it is still the case. Not really an issue given the amount ive spent on Cakewalk over the decades but for newcomers I can see that it looks infinitely more expensive than CBB !
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby N i g e l » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:00 pm

The Bunk wrote:
N i g e l wrote:
I think 30 days is long enough to get the gist of somthing but I dont like not being able to "save" and continue later from where I left off. Strabgely, I dont mind being interrupted every so often but I do hate waiting for uTube adverts to finish, in 5 4 3 2 1..
maybe thats it.
------------------------


Are you saying you can't "save" any new work you've done? Sorry if I've misunderstood that but I don't have that issue with my upgrade which I am still "evaluating", more through laziness...I will of course when I can get my *rse into gear.


no No No Sorry ! I was meaning those issues are for other product evaluations I ve used.
Reaper "demo" is what you get with the full package.

Im not a power user, so my evaluation will be over by the end of the up coming holidays. I havent used 1/2 the facilities on my current DAW and Reaper seems to have a whole level of coding applications that seem limitless but which I may never use
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby N i g e l » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:07 pm

The Red Bladder wrote: He even writes a blog on aspects of coding and how to reduce the number of commands - http://1014.org/?article=518
It's all there for you to mug-up on, if you are into C++ compilers!

Ill bookmark that for reading some other day !

What you say makes sense though & add in a layer for when the company changes hands (several times).
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby The Bunk » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:11 pm

N i g e l wrote:
no No No Sorry ! I was meaning those issues are for other product evaluations I ve used.
Reaper "demo" is what you get with the full package.


:thumbup:
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Re: Reaper 6 is out

Postby desmond » Mon Dec 09, 2019 5:49 pm

The Red Bladder wrote:All sorts of wild speculation about why Reaper is both faster and has a smaller footprint and the reality is that there are many reasons

Indeed.

The biggest reason is likely not inherently because of a small team of long-time coders (there are benefits to that, but also small teams also put a limit on the amount of actual work that can get done), but is that performance and small footprint are valued by those developers and are prioritised.

I can't say much about ProTools, but know a bit about Logic, and I can tell you that the vast majority of the small team of Logic developers are the same ones that have been working on it for a long time. (Of course, with a company like Apple, you have a bunch of extra layers of management and "product owners" etc, and you have a bunch of large-company politics and structures you have to work within, which adds overhead).

For what it's worth, the app bundle size of Reaper 6 is 120, version Logic's current version of 1.5GB. Quite a difference! However, the actual main program binaries are not that different - Reaper is about 14 MB, Logic is about 36 MB. The difference is usually all kinds of other bundle resources, libraries and code to do other things. Reaper has something like 40 MB of icon files, for example. Logic has a whole bunch of framework code for all it's audio plugins, instruments and other things. And the size of Logic doesn't even begin to factor additional content such as impulse responses, drum samples, apple loop content, multisampled instruments and so on.

The more you want software to be able to do, generally speaking, the more code you need - and this has nothing as such to do with good code or bad code.

Reaper *is* efficient, and it is so not because it's a two man dev team, but because they are good at what they do, and they value efficiency, so it is integral to of all the code they write - and they have few other people to report to who might revise their objectives and targets at any given moment.

Reaper is also small because there are many things Reaper doesn't have, compared to other, more fully featured apps, which offer a lot more.

It also occupies a particular niche in the world of DAWs, and is a great product for what it is, and what it costs.
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