You are here

Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

All about the tools and techniques involved in capturing sound, in the studio or on location.

Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Arpangel » Tue Jul 28, 2020 8:24 am

I normally record Midi loops in Reaper, all is fine, no problems.
But lately I’ve been experimenting with audio loops, and I always get clicks at the start and end of loops, no matter how I edit them, playing with small volume curves, the clicks are always there. I understand that it’s good to edit at a "zero crossing" in the waveform, but I’m wondering if there’s a setting somewhere in Reaper that does this automatically?
User avatar
Arpangel
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4965
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:00 am

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby shufflebeat » Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:36 am

The fade in/out is normally my friend in this situation but maybe that's what you refer to when you talk about volume curve.

I'm surprised sometimes how long I can push a fade, particularly out, before it starts to become obvious.

One of the good things is, wherever you choose to edit will become a zero point when the fade kicks in.
shufflebeat
Jedi Poster
Posts: 5023
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:00 am
Location: Manchester, UK
"Dance, dance. wherever you may be, for I am the Lord of the damp settee..."

Do yourself a favour, wear earplugs at gigs.

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Arpangel » Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:38 am

shufflebeat wrote:The fade in/out is normally my friend in this situation but maybe that's what you refer to when you talk about volume curve.

I'm surprised sometimes how long I can push a fade, particularly out, before it starts to become obvious.

Yes, I try that, sometimes it works, depends on the nature of the loop, getting a seamless fade. I’ve got to investigate Ableton, as it may be more suitable in this regard.
User avatar
Arpangel
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4965
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:00 am

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby shufflebeat » Tue Jul 28, 2020 9:43 am

It's been a while since I've needed to do this but when editing drums for sampling I found fade *type* was also pretty situation-specific. It must have been Reaper because I havent used anything else for a few years.

Now you've piqued my curiosity, I'll investigate later.
shufflebeat
Jedi Poster
Posts: 5023
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:00 am
Location: Manchester, UK
"Dance, dance. wherever you may be, for I am the Lord of the damp settee..."

Do yourself a favour, wear earplugs at gigs.

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Hugh Robjohns » Tue Jul 28, 2020 11:09 am

Arpangel wrote:I’ve been experimenting with audio loops, and I always get clicks at the start and end of loops, no matter how I edit them, playing with small volume curves, the clicks are always there. I understand that it’s good to edit at a "zero crossing" in the waveform...

Editing at a zero crossing does not guarantee a click-less edit. It very much depends on what the audio is doing either side of the zero-crossing point!

Clickless edits are entirely dependent on the placement of the edit relative to the wanted sound, and the duration and shape of the cross-fade. It's not rocket science, but it does take some experience and often some experimentation to find the best solution for each situation.
User avatar
Hugh Robjohns
Moderator
Posts: 28322
Joined: Fri Jul 25, 2003 12:00 am
Location: Worcestershire, UK
Technical Editor, Sound On Sound

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Arpangel » Tue Jul 28, 2020 11:29 am

Hugh Robjohns wrote:
Arpangel wrote:I’ve been experimenting with audio loops, and I always get clicks at the start and end of loops, no matter how I edit them, playing with small volume curves, the clicks are always there. I understand that it’s good to edit at a "zero crossing" in the waveform...

Editing at a zero crossing does not guarantee a click-less edit. It very much depends on what the audio is doing either side of the zero-crossing point!

Clickless edits are entirely dependent on the placement of the edit relative to the wanted sound, and the duration and shape of the cross-fade. It's not rocket science, but it does take some experience and often some experimentation to find the best solution for each situation.

Thanks Hugh, I’ll continue to experiment, but I was just wondering if any DAW's are better at fades/ cross-fades than others? I used Samplitude for awhile, and the editor in that was a lot more comprehensive, but maybe it’s not necessary.
User avatar
Arpangel
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4965
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:00 am

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby shufflebeat » Tue Jul 28, 2020 12:00 pm

Can't find the old drum edit project at the minute but sparked up Reaper and had a look. If memory serves it was the "S" shaped curve that was the most transparent for me.

Apologies if I'm "egg-sucking" teaching here but I'm constantly finding out things that others assume are obvious so I assume nothing.
shufflebeat
Jedi Poster
Posts: 5023
Joined: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:00 am
Location: Manchester, UK
"Dance, dance. wherever you may be, for I am the Lord of the damp settee..."

Do yourself a favour, wear earplugs at gigs.

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby James Perrett » Tue Jul 28, 2020 2:38 pm

In Reaper click on a problem loop, press F2 and take a look at the top right corner of the window that appears. You'll see the fade time and fade shape for the start and end of the loop. It is also worth making sure that you don't have snapping enabled when doing fine edits.
User avatar
James Perrett
Moderator
Posts: 9654
Joined: Mon Sep 10, 2001 12:00 am
Location: The wilds of Hampshire
JRP Music - Audio Mastering and Restoration. JRP Music Facebook Page

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Arpangel » Wed Jul 29, 2020 6:42 am

James Perrett wrote:In Reaper click on a problem loop, press F2 and take a look at the top right corner of the window that appears. You'll see the fade time and fade shape for the start and end of the loop. It is also worth making sure that you don't have snapping enabled when doing fine edits.

Thanks James, snapping? Yes, that could be an issue, I use it sometimes, and I’m terrible at noticing things that should be off, I forget, I’ll also try the S curve as well.
User avatar
Arpangel
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4965
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:00 am

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Martin Walker » Wed Jul 29, 2020 10:48 am

Yes, I find myself switching Snapping on and off an awful lot for time alignment of imported tracks, and tweaking of the odd note in otherwise great performances.


Martin
User avatar
Martin Walker
Moderator
Posts: 16234
Joined: Wed Jan 13, 2010 9:44 am
Location: Cornwall, UK

Re: Clicks when creating loops in Reaper.

Postby Arpangel » Thu Jul 30, 2020 8:29 am

Martin Walker wrote:Yes, I find myself switching Snapping on and off an awful lot for time alignment of imported tracks, and tweaking of the odd note in otherwise great performances.


Martin

I often find myself tweaking thousands of notes in what are otherwise terrible performances.

:D
User avatar
Arpangel
Jedi Poster
Posts: 4965
Joined: Sat Jul 12, 2003 12:00 am