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who needs a guitarist these days?

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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby IvanSC » Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:33 pm

If you play a particular instrument, the synth version of it never ever sounds right, no matter who is programming the sounds or the sequence. So sure if you arent a guitar player I am sure this sounds perfect. As a bass player I program all my bass lines for live use, but it sure as hell doesnt sound like a real bass player.

Looking forward to seeing what Will Lee and I can do on my new Akai sampler, but I am wind up just recordng me playing the bass....
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby iceman » Tue Jun 14, 2005 11:53 pm

here are also lots of real drummers out there who you could also ask to record for you. However, their night shift at McDonalds doesn't make it convenient to get them round to record during social hours so I'd stick with DFH

oh dear me another subscriber to the tony blackburn 70`s jokebook, drummer jokes are so old and out of date get with the program dikwad
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Rick Taylor » Wed Jun 15, 2005 12:27 am

giles wrote:it's a non question really confusing synthesised sound with accoustic sound both different & complementary like many instrumental lineups. The boring bit is that the musical glory of our time (synthesised sound) has to be reduced to the banality of imitating an acoustic instrument. A very good example of the two working together is the work of Phill Durrant & John Butcher.
G

I think you've hit the nail on the head. Unfortunately, synthesized sound is old hat. Strangely enough, I don't think it's ever been used to its full extent seeing as the above situation does exist. Much of that's due to the audience.

An excellent example of the two working together would be bands like King Crimson, Genesis, Ultravox, Yes, E.L.P., Tangerine Dream, most of the early eighties, etc...
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Rick Taylor » Wed Jun 15, 2005 12:29 am

Louise wrote:If we didn't have guitarists & drummers etc we would end up with a load of talantless parasitic dj's trying to make music on computers...oh [ ****** ] i forgot, that's what we already have!!! the people who are unable to play any instruments at all & are unable to read music but are making what they think is music from samples etc on a pc,,,you might have an ok ear for a beat but to make music!!!!.........look at the state of the current charts etc,,,,,,i rest my case.....

Why is a computer not a musical instrument? Why are DJ's even part of this discussion?
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Drumman74 » Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:58 am

It's just easiest to not have guitars on your recording...
And I might add, that if you do use the VST's, you get the sound without the Ego!
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Rick Taylor » Wed Jun 15, 2005 2:47 am

:} Ego being the lifeblood of music.
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby IvanSC » Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:22 am

(rofl)Drumman: does anyone actually use real live drummers on their recordings any more? How does that make you feel when you hear all the lame drum programming there is out there?
This is exactly the point I was trying to make in my earlier post about only a real player of the actual instrument will really know how far away friom the real thing most sampled "versions" of their instrument is.
Stop and think a bit before you blithely write off all guitar players. After all, someone has to play it in the first place for you to sample it. Ridiculously, I am a bass player and even I use sampled parts mostly, but then I am not recording for commercial release at present. Samples and sequences are usually quicker.
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby neonknight » Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:58 am

people who claim guitars can be sampled and replaced by VSTs obviously never played guitar. If they did, they would know jow expressive the instruments is.. If you don't trust me, ask Mr Paul White :)
seriously, when you get a guitar VST to sound like Jeff Beck, Gary Moore or Stevie Ray Vaughan, to name just a few, I will believe you...if you ask me, the same goes for drumming...it is more difficult to tell the difference, of course, but there is a difference. It has probably got something to do with the nature of the instrument...
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Rick Taylor » Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:34 am

:} Santana... Haino... Belew... Frith... West {Leslie}... Steve Morse...

{Resisting the urge to fill the page.}
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Wigworld » Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:54 am

Isn't that what Keane did?

Wonkey Wabbit wrote:You could probably do a Coldplay album with VST guitars and get away with it.

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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Virtuoso » Wed Jun 15, 2005 11:18 am

iceman wrote:drummer jokes are so old and out of date get with the program dikwad

First DJ: Wanna go to the cinema tonight?
Second DJ: Dunno, who's the projectionist?
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby neonknight » Wed Jun 15, 2005 12:54 pm

Rick Taylor wrote::} Santana... Haino... Belew... Frith... West {Leslie}... Steve Morse...

{Resisting the urge to fill the page.}
satriani, vai, fripp, malmsteen, petrucci, pass, di meola, mclaughlin, de lucia, gilmour, vinnie moore, blackmore, page, frampton...the list is HUGE! :)
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Loudbox » Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:15 pm

If you have ever had a world class session muscian playing in front of you in your studio then you would know the difference! I won't name drop but I was lucky enough to have one of the best guitar players around doing some session work in the studio the other day. No plugin would replace that in a million years.
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Armadillo » Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:51 pm

neonknight wrote:
Rick Taylor wrote::} Santana... Haino... Belew... Frith... West {Leslie}... Steve Morse...

{Resisting the urge to fill the page.}
satriani, vai, fripp, malmsteen, petrucci, pass, di meola, mclaughlin, de lucia, gilmour, vinnie moore, blackmore, page, frampton...the list is HUGE! :)

I know hmm... well I've got an idea of how 5 of these guys sound but don't know the rest. But I love RealGuitar but not as a mean of sounding like Satriani etc. If that's the sound one is looking for surely you can already play the guitar better than you can enter notes in a Midi editor or play the keyboard.
For me it's a way of adding a bit of guitar flavour to my tunes, like eg. NERD. Something basic anyway. If your tunes are 100% guitar based, you obviously get a guitar. But if the guitar is hidden somewhere in the back it'll do very well. To put it another way: RealGuitar is great for pop, house, RnB, Hip hop and electronica. For rock, punk, metal and blues I'd get a guitarist.
I suspect everybody is this thread falls into the 2nd category anyway.
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Re: who needs a guitarist these days?

Postby Rick Taylor » Wed Jun 15, 2005 1:58 pm

neonknight wrote:frampton...the list is HUGE! :)


Frampton?

:) Forgot Duane Allman, Dickie Betts, Tommy Bolin, Mick Ronson, Edge, Helios Creed, BBKing, Buckethead, Howe, Buck Dharma, Zappa, Mick Box and Nick Zinner... {and a cast of thousands.}

I saw Dixie Dregs live from about 2 feet away. Morse is plain amazing. Blackmore, as well. {Actually, I've seen most of these guys live... They're all pretty amazing.}

Frampton?
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